February of 2008 I signed up for a ventrilo account with nationvoice.com. The service was decent, but it turned out I really had no use for it. Six months later I canceled the service with them.
November 23 I was billed by them again. Their billing policy is once every 3 months, so apparently I didn’t notice the third payment I made to them after cancelation.
I attempted to contact them to resolve the matter but receive nothing from them. I then reported it to paypal. This must have gotten their attention because they finally replied to me saying that,
If someone discontinues their service or agreement with the named person (or company) the subscription was created for, then they also need to cancel the subscription, PayPal has no way to know whether your service or agreement is still in effect unless you inform them of the status.What that means in a nutshell is that should you stop the service that the subscription was originally created for, you must also cancel the subscription or it will remain in force until such time as you cancel it. Additionally, please don’t confuse your service (with us in this case) with your PayPal subscription; they are two separate things. We hope this helps clear up some of the confusion.
Basically this means, “We will trick you into thinking you have canceled your account and never refund you for additional payment made.” Or, “We are crooks.”
As a PayPal merchant, I know you can reverse payments in paypal even if it is a subscription. However if you choose not to, then your a bad business person. If you choose not to after wrongfully taking money for 6 months (more than one payment), then you are a crook.
Info about their business:
Nation Voice Communications LLC
+1.(888) 242-6486 Phone
+1.(888) 242-6486 Fax
91 W. 12th St.
Bayonne, New Jersey 07002
United States
www.nationvoice.com
owners@nationvoice.com
Yes, I’m warming up for my campaign against these guys.
Update: 12/04/08
After not receiving a response to my last email asking them if they would refund my money, I decided to take the next step. I submitted a complaint to the Better Business Bureau. This will put a black mark on their business record and perhaps persued them into refunding me.
I also started a letter that I was going to send to ArtofWarCentral.com but didn’t yet send it. I am thinking of offering anyone who has ventrilo to switch from NationVoice to ArtofWarCentral and I will give them a free MODSonline account and a discount on their ventrilo.
Update: 12/04/08 (night)
A new employee from NationVoice called me and said he could help me last night. Either this thing could get resolved or he’s just new to the whole screwing over thing. His name was Mark and he told be I could resubmit the the contact form with my transaction ID from paypal and he would take care of it. That his bosses Justin and Craig should be able to help.
Also for the record, he confirmed that I canceled my account on May 18, 2008. I was charged again in August which I cannot receive a refund for due to the time that’s passed. I was charged again on Nov. 23, 2008 and that we should be able to resolve.
Next up if this doesn’t go well, I will contact a lawyer to see what the next step is.
Update 12/18/08
Yesterday I followed up with Nationvoice to find out what’s going on. I still hadn’t heard any news from them. Last night I received an email from them stating that a refund was granted and this morning PayPal has confirmed that for me.
Geez, it wasn’t easy but I got the money back. I will be MUCH more skeptical of subscriptions from now on. Sure, MODSonline requires a subscription and I have run into a few people who contest on PayPal the charge. And yes, our policy states we don’t have to refund you, but I ALWAYS do refund the person. I want people to think of MODSonline kindly.
It was fortunate for them that they didn’t wait another 5 days. That would have been the 30 day mark and my next course of action was to start telling my story to the computer and gaming magazines. All those magazines have a department that LOVE to hunt down and resolve such issues. And my tactic was to continually make this more and more public until it was resolved.
I don’t think I was upset so much about losing the money, or potential of losing it. I was upset that this company thought they could get away with taking the money. I probably would have fought this for $20. I felt “taken” or “scammed” and was going to make it my goal to stop it from happening again. With Nationvoice residing in my Country and State, it made it that much more feasible.
OK. So, I’m beginning to ramble here. I hope a lesson has been learned by NationVoice. A lesson was certainly learned here.
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